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	<title>Comments on: Obama to Address Immigration In the Face of Opposition</title>
	<atom:link href="http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/2009/04/08/obama-to-address-immigration-in-the-face-of-opposition/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/2009/04/08/obama-to-address-immigration-in-the-face-of-opposition/</link>
	<description>Where Manifest Destiny Goes to Die</description>
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		<title>By: nezua</title>
		<link>http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/2009/04/08/obama-to-address-immigration-in-the-face-of-opposition/comment-page-1/#comment-2418</link>
		<dc:creator>nezua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Apr 2009 22:06:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/?p=2297#comment-2418</guid>
		<description>Well, I&#039;ll have to let Elían know if he doesn&#039;t already, who I roll with, and more importantly, what kind of approach is expected if one wants to be respected back. I hate when people get all crazy antiObama like that, it&#039;s just not the way to discuss anything, and it really highlights what doesn&#039;t work so well about onine socializing. But you put it pretty clearly at that post.

Honestly, &#039;mano, I&#039;ve seen this a few times...people let their antipathy toward Obama really...cause them to  act poorly to people who have nothing to do with their anger. They are seeing demons. There are things to be said, and then there&#039;s just...spilling your own emotion with no regard to what&#039;s being said.

Reply to Derail over and out!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, I&#8217;ll have to let Elían know if he doesn&#8217;t already, who I roll with, and more importantly, what kind of approach is expected if one wants to be respected back. I hate when people get all crazy antiObama like that, it&#8217;s just not the way to discuss anything, and it really highlights what doesn&#8217;t work so well about onine socializing. But you put it pretty clearly at that post.</p>
<p>Honestly, &#8216;mano, I&#8217;ve seen this a few times&#8230;people let their antipathy toward Obama really&#8230;cause them to  act poorly to people who have nothing to do with their anger. They are seeing demons. There are things to be said, and then there&#8217;s just&#8230;spilling your own emotion with no regard to what&#8217;s being said.</p>
<p>Reply to Derail over and out!</p>
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		<title>By: Kai</title>
		<link>http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/2009/04/08/obama-to-address-immigration-in-the-face-of-opposition/comment-page-1/#comment-2417</link>
		<dc:creator>Kai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Apr 2009 21:35:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/?p=2297#comment-2417</guid>
		<description>Oh shit, Nez, this Elián person is holding forth here too? 

Check out &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.kaichang.net/2009/03/march-madness-presidential-bracket.html?cid=6a00d83451bb1169e20115701551ac970b#comment-6a00d83451bb1169e20115701551ac970b&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;this ridiculous comment&lt;/a&gt; he left at my pad today. He doesn&#039;t appear to know that you and I are co-bloggers at The Sanctuary. And doesn&#039;t it seem like he approached me with, shall we say, a different attitude than his comments in this thread? Ya gotta wonder why.

Not lookin good, Elián, not good at all.

Anyway, sorry to drop this here, Nez, it just struck me right after posting my comment in response to him, I come over here and see the same name! Hehe. 

End of derail.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh shit, Nez, this Elián person is holding forth here too? </p>
<p>Check out <a href="http://www.kaichang.net/2009/03/march-madness-presidential-bracket.html?cid=6a00d83451bb1169e20115701551ac970b#comment-6a00d83451bb1169e20115701551ac970b" rel="nofollow">this ridiculous comment</a> he left at my pad today. He doesn&#8217;t appear to know that you and I are co-bloggers at <a title="The Sanctuary" href="http://promigrant.org">The Sanctuary</a>. And doesn&#8217;t it seem like he approached me with, shall we say, a different attitude than his comments in this thread? Ya gotta wonder why.</p>
<p>Not lookin good, Elián, not good at all.</p>
<p>Anyway, sorry to drop this here, Nez, it just struck me right after posting my comment in response to him, I come over here and see the same name! Hehe. </p>
<p>End of derail.</p>
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		<title>By: nezua</title>
		<link>http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/2009/04/08/obama-to-address-immigration-in-the-face-of-opposition/comment-page-1/#comment-2416</link>
		<dc:creator>nezua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Apr 2009 20:45:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/?p=2297#comment-2416</guid>
		<description>good point, thanks macon.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>good point, thanks macon.</p>
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		<title>By: macon d</title>
		<link>http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/2009/04/08/obama-to-address-immigration-in-the-face-of-opposition/comment-page-1/#comment-2415</link>
		<dc:creator>macon d</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Apr 2009 20:32:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/?p=2297#comment-2415</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the phone number. A call to the Times seems in order too; or else a letter to the editor, if people even do that anymore.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the phone number. A call to the Times seems in order too; or else a letter to the editor, if people even do that anymore.</p>
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		<title>By: Elián Maricón</title>
		<link>http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/2009/04/08/obama-to-address-immigration-in-the-face-of-opposition/comment-page-1/#comment-2391</link>
		<dc:creator>Elián Maricón</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 05:37:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/?p=2297#comment-2391</guid>
		<description>It is encouraging that the issue is again being brought to the forefront of the national political debate, but this time in a different light.  And yes, he will certainly need to mobilize support, and if he moves on this. I&#039;ll do my part.

May your optimism prove to be prescient.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is encouraging that the issue is again being brought to the forefront of the national political debate, but this time in a different light.  And yes, he will certainly need to mobilize support, and if he moves on this. I&#8217;ll do my part.</p>
<p>May your optimism prove to be prescient.</p>
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		<title>By: nezua</title>
		<link>http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/2009/04/08/obama-to-address-immigration-in-the-face-of-opposition/comment-page-1/#comment-2390</link>
		<dc:creator>nezua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 05:12:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/?p=2297#comment-2390</guid>
		<description>Well, I have some of the same apprehension that you do. On the other hand, I do think he realizes that even if he moves decisively on it, he will need to mobilize much support to fight the haters who are BOUND to be rather pissy and flapping about loudly in response to this. So in essence, one could read that also as &quot;true, many helped get me in here and I made promises. Now I need to address those promises. And I&#039;ll need those people to support me while I do.&quot; 

Of course...that could easily be my own hopeful nature rising once again. I&#039;m afraid, too, that the end result will be a watered down compromise that doesn&#039;t change the fundamentals of the situation, much as some are accusing Geithner of doing with the economy/banksters. 

But for now, it is very encouraging, especially the chosen verbiage. Using &quot;path to legalization&quot; or related phrases seems to me to be giving direct challenge to those who would use that phrase as if a curse, saying &quot;I anticipate your lash back and I walk into it knowingly.&quot;

We&#039;ll see.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, I have some of the same apprehension that you do. On the other hand, I do think he realizes that even if he moves decisively on it, he will need to mobilize much support to fight the haters who are BOUND to be rather pissy and flapping about loudly in response to this. So in essence, one could read that also as &#8220;true, many helped get me in here and I made promises. Now I need to address those promises. And I&#8217;ll need those people to support me while I do.&#8221; </p>
<p>Of course&#8230;that could easily be my own hopeful nature rising once again. I&#8217;m afraid, too, that the end result will be a watered down compromise that doesn&#8217;t change the fundamentals of the situation, much as some are accusing Geithner of doing with the economy/banksters. </p>
<p>But for now, it is very encouraging, especially the chosen verbiage. Using &#8220;path to legalization&#8221; or related phrases seems to me to be giving direct challenge to those who would use that phrase as if a curse, saying &#8220;I anticipate your lash back and I walk into it knowingly.&#8221;</p>
<p>We&#8217;ll see.</p>
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		<title>By: Elián Maricón</title>
		<link>http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/2009/04/08/obama-to-address-immigration-in-the-face-of-opposition/comment-page-1/#comment-2389</link>
		<dc:creator>Elián Maricón</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 04:58:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theunapologeticmexican.org/elmachete/?p=2297#comment-2389</guid>
		<description>I sincerely hope Obama follows through with this particular promise.  His record for keeping campaign promises so far is less than stellar. If he actually comes through on this one without compromising to the point that the resultant legislation is rendered essentially useless, I will be among the first to express my gratitude.

The cynic in me is inclined to believe that he won&#039;t follow through with this campaign promise just like he has changed his positions on Cuba, tax policy, the Iraq war, warantless wiretapping, etc. since he won the election.

He (and the Democratic establishment) also appear to be positioning themselves to allow the EFCA to be defeated due to an expected Repub filibuster, at which point they will throw up their hands in feigned exasperation and say, &quot;Whattaya gonna do?&quot;  The fact is Obama and the dems have the power to defeat the Repubs on the EFCA, but many of them actually oppose it while others only support it half-heartedly.  Instead of taking it to the mat and fighting a battle they could win, I suspect they are going to cave to big business

So while I hope and pray Obama will go to battle on the immigration issue, I found this quote from that NYT article to be quite foreboding:

&quot;Anticipating opposition, Mr. Obama has sought to shift some of the political burden to advocates for immigrants, by encouraging them to build support among voters for when his proposal goes to Congress.&quot;

So if it goes down in flames, Obama can point to us and say, &quot;Hey, it ain&#039;t my fault...you people didn&#039;t work hard enough.&quot;  Politically, that would be the savvy thing to do because he can maintain the support of  Latinos by saying he &quot;tried&quot; while simultaneously not incurring too much wrath from the rabid xenophobes who would mobilize against him on a massive scale in 2012 should he actually institute meaningful immigration reform.

Let&#039;s hope that I have to eat massive amounts of crow as a result of this prediction.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I sincerely hope Obama follows through with this particular promise.  His record for keeping campaign promises so far is less than stellar. If he actually comes through on this one without compromising to the point that the resultant legislation is rendered essentially useless, I will be among the first to express my gratitude.</p>
<p>The cynic in me is inclined to believe that he won&#8217;t follow through with this campaign promise just like he has changed his positions on Cuba, tax policy, the Iraq war, warantless wiretapping, etc. since he won the election.</p>
<p>He (and the Democratic establishment) also appear to be positioning themselves to allow the EFCA to be defeated due to an expected Repub filibuster, at which point they will throw up their hands in feigned exasperation and say, &#8220;Whattaya gonna do?&#8221;  The fact is Obama and the dems have the power to defeat the Repubs on the EFCA, but many of them actually oppose it while others only support it half-heartedly.  Instead of taking it to the mat and fighting a battle they could win, I suspect they are going to cave to big business</p>
<p>So while I hope and pray Obama will go to battle on the immigration issue, I found this quote from that NYT article to be quite foreboding:</p>
<p>&#8220;Anticipating opposition, Mr. Obama has sought to shift some of the political burden to advocates for immigrants, by encouraging them to build support among voters for when his proposal goes to Congress.&#8221;</p>
<p>So if it goes down in flames, Obama can point to us and say, &#8220;Hey, it ain&#8217;t my fault&#8230;you people didn&#8217;t work hard enough.&#8221;  Politically, that would be the savvy thing to do because he can maintain the support of  Latinos by saying he &#8220;tried&#8221; while simultaneously not incurring too much wrath from the rabid xenophobes who would mobilize against him on a massive scale in 2012 should he actually institute meaningful immigration reform.</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s hope that I have to eat massive amounts of crow as a result of this prediction.</p>
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